Thread: Separation of Church and State

Originally Posted by Think for myself

Indeed.

I have shed the trappings of blindly following the interpretaions of the sky fairy mandates.

You just don'y have the right color of cool shades to see em.

Originally Posted by chu chu rocket

You and I can support removing laws that protects religious practice, like a ban on working on Sundays. Or marriage laws founded in holy scripture.

If you want to remove anti-religion sentiments out of the state, and not having the state tout atheism, then you would need to remove laws restricting religious people from excercising their religion. That is where your problem starts. Is there a clearly defined distinction between banning wearing a cross, banning a head scarf, banning multiple marriages, banning selling your wife or banning female genital mutilation?

How is there problems by the government not restricting religious people from excersing their religion? As long as some religous cerenomy doesn't break some already existing law, then there is no problem.

Therefore it is illegal for someone to steal your wife (kidnapping I guess) but someone can wear a cross or have strange religious ceremonies if the people agree.

From what you have said doesn't make it hard to have a government secular from religion or atheism.

Originally Posted by Nerv14

How is there problems by the government not restricting religious people from excersing their religion? As long as some religous cerenomy doesn't break some already existing law, then there is no problem.

Forget it. There is no problem.

Originally Posted by Tick

Your not heathen, your a barbarian, and proud!

Barbarians are people that dont speak greek, fyi.

Originally Posted by Nerv14

How is there problems by the government not restricting religious people from excersing their religion?

One high school teacher can wax eloquent about the power of collectivism and its potential to shape society. He can speak with passion and verve and invite students to read his favorite book or novel on the subject.

The other teacher cannot share his faith as a power to reform society. He cannot speak with passion and recommend his favorite book on the subject.

In both cases, the students are required BY LAW to be in those classes.

Now you can pretend the former doesn't happen. But unless you are everywhere, you cannot be sure. And the former case is not against the law. If we have a truly secular society, it should be. If we had the society the founders envisioned, both would be allowed.

The way things now, some belief systems are promoted and others are denied access.

Originally Posted by kmiller1610

One high school teacher can wax eloquent about the power of collectivism and its potential to shape society. He can speak with passion and verve and invite students to read his favorite book or novel on the subject.

The other teacher cannot share his faith as a power to reform society. He cannot speak with passion and recommend his favorite book on the subject.

In both cases, the students are required BY LAW to be in those classes.

Now you can pretend the former doesn't happen. But unless you are everywhere, you cannot be sure. And the former case is not against the law. If we have a truly secular society, it should be. If we had the society the founders envisioned, both would be allowed.

The way things now, some belief systems are promoted and others are denied access.

I do not know what you are trying to say. Could you explain it more.

How are students required by law to be in a religion or politics class?

I know the second example does happen but I don't think public school teachers aren't suppose to influence their students about politics or religion. So I think the laws for public schools in America are separated from religion and politics enough. However, that doesn't mean that teachers actually follow it.

I had one of those commy teachers in high school...

Originally Posted by Tick

You just don'y have the right color of cool shades to see em.

Like this color?

Originally Posted by Nerv14

public school teachers aren't suppose to influence their students about politics or religion. So I think the laws for public schools in America are separated from religion and politics enough. However, that doesn't mean that teachers actually follow it. I had one of those commy teachers in high school...

I think free expression of all types (as long as there is no compulsion to conform) should be the norm.

But if not, then all values based or life-philosophy based discussions and instruction should be limited to voluntary classes.

Originally Posted by Nerv14

I do not know what you are trying to say. Could you explain it more.

The courts have established a hair trigger response to anything connected to the majority religion - Christianity.

But there are no protections from students being preached at, on the basis of other life philosophies, from Socialism to Secular Humanism to Earth Worship.

This does not seem right to me. They should all be treated the same. You either allow all expression or you have to tighten control over all.