American Farenheit 451 - Page 15

conservative · 08-29-2008, 04:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davocrat

But you did title the thread "American Fahrenheit 451," a title that refers to the temperature of burning books and a plot that centers around the same.

So is your point that liberals might propose reinstatement of the Fairness Doctrine and that's kind of like book burning?

Bravo! You are still the all-mighty Davo!

conservative · 08-29-2008, 04:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnlocke

Ah, so your feeling is that a metaphorical "book burning" (which is a HUGE stretch) by liberals

It is a metaphor John. A metaphor...and no restiction of freedom of speech is a very real threat today from both the left and the right. You did read that part of the post didn't you?

Quote:

is worse than the decades of ACTUAL book burning and censorship practiced by the radical right. That the POTENTIAL for censorship (by the left) is more important and real than the ACTUAL censorhip by rightist organizations like the HUAC.

Now there is a a stretch! No where in my post did I try to ignore the past, of course there have been abuses of liberties from both ends of the spectrum...

Quote:

You have somehow drawn the erroneous conclusoin that Fahrenheit 451 speaks to the POTENTIAL for abuse by liberals rather than the long HISTORY OF ABUSE by self proclaimed conservatives and conservative groups.

No, I didn't reach that conclusion. I heard Bradberry being interviewed, and he said that the genesis of the book was his love for books, and his learning of the book burnings in alexandria (no radical right Republicans back then) and the Nazi book burnings. He began writing his thoughts in a couple short stories starting in 1948...just three years after the world experienced the terror of Tyrannical regimes.

Now I know the left thinks and calls GWB a tyrant, and I am expressing my fear of the left if they gain control of the congress, senate, and the Presidency. Wasn't the leftists on this site who treated us to six years of rants about needing a balanced government when GWB had a Repub congress and senate? Why is it now good for the country to have all Democrat? The left hates talk radio and will do everything in it's power to destroy it. They will not be overt and put forth legislation to outlaw it, put they will put forth enough hurdles to destroy it, and that is denying freedom.

That is the burning of Talk Radio.

Just curious John....do you think the left is incapable of tyrannical behavior?

Ausinus · 08-29-2008, 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conservative

Just curious John....do you think the left is incapable of tyrannical behavior?

Of course not - look at extreme socialism. However, they are far less inclined to tyranny, liberals by their nature standing for the rights of the people.

sid2112 · 08-29-2008, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ausinus

Of course not - look at extreme socialism. However, they are far less inclined to tyranny, liberals by their nature standing for the rights of the people.

I disagree, I find that most liberals are concerned about a certain group of people, mainly poorer people. I'm not saying that poor people shouldn't be helped, I'm saying that everyone deserves consideration no matter what your financial status is.

johnlocke · 08-29-2008, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conservative

It is a metaphor John. A metaphor...and no restiction of freedom of speech is a very real threat today from both the left and the right. You did read that part of the post didn't you?

Now there is a a stretch! No where in my post did I try to ignore the past, of course there have been abuses of liberties from both ends of the spectrum...

No, I didn't reach that conclusion. I heard Bradberry being interviewed, and he said that the genesis of the book was his love for books, and his learning of the book burnings in alexandria (no radical right Republicans back then) and the Nazi book burnings. He began writing his thoughts in a couple short stories starting in 1948...just three years after the world experienced the terror of Tyrannical regimes.

Now I know the left thinks and calls GWB a tyrant, and I am expressing my fear of the left if they gain control of the congress, senate, and the Presidency. Wasn't the leftists on this site who treated us to six years of rants about needing a balanced government when GWB had a Repub congress and senate? Why is it now good for the country to have all Democrat? The left hates talk radio and will do everything in it's power to destroy it. They will not be overt and put forth legislation to outlaw it, put they will put forth enough hurdles to destroy it, and that is denying freedom.

That is the burning of Talk Radio.

Just curious John....do you think the left is incapable of tyrannical behavior?

Did you hurt yourself with that wild leap of illogic? Where did I mention GWB, on this topic? Nowhere.

If you're going to jump to wrong conclusions (like that) you really should warm up first.

The point here is that you are claiming that the left MIGHT infringe on a liberty. You have no proof that the left has EVER used the fairness doctrine in the manner you described. Even the Red Lion case makes no such assumption.

On the other hand, the right HAS held book burnings, has attempted to censor books (among them Catcher in the Rye, the Grapes of Wrath, Slaughterhouse Five, Fahrenheit 451, 1984, Ulysses, and A naked lunch), has now attempted to ban books like Harry Potter. Indeed, if anyone can be said to be contemptuous of our first amendment rights it is the radical right.

Can the left be tyrrannical? Yes, but historically it has been the RIGHT who has acted to restrict access to differing points of view. It has been the right which has acted (and continues to act) out of a fearful belief that new ideas (even fantasies such as Harry Potter) are a threat to their Weltanschauung and their authority. Given the history, in this matter, I would say that any attempt to decry censorship should START by denouncing the radical right rather than attempting to pillory the left for things it has not (and in all probability won't) do.

conservative · 08-29-2008, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnlocke

The point here is that you are claiming that the left MIGHT infringe on a liberty.

And historically they have...FDR placing American citizens in concentration camps, the Kennedy's wire-tapping MLK, and now you have Obama people threatening radio stations...yes the threat is real.

Michelle Malkin � Obama threatens TV stations airing Ayers ad

Quote:

Can the left be tyrrannical? Yes, but historically it has been the RIGHT who has acted to restrict access to differing points of view. It has been the right which has acted (and continues to act) out of a fearful belief that new ideas (even fantasies such as Harry Potter) are a threat to their Weltanschauung and their authority. Given the history, in this matter, I would say that any attempt to decry censorship should START by denouncing the radical right rather than attempting to pillory the left for things it has not (and in all probability won't) do.

I am more than happy to decry anyone who wants to question the sexual preference of Tinkie-winkie...

Inkslinger · 08-29-2008, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sid2112

I disagree, I find that most liberals are concerned about a certain group of people, mainly poorer people. I'm not saying that poor people shouldn't be helped, I'm saying that everyone deserves consideration no matter what your financial status is.

That's true... I dragged my ass out of the gutter and now hire the un-employed.
Unemployment is a big concern to me.

Latherty · 08-29-2008, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conservative

What are we to expect if the Democrats controll the Whitehouse and Congress? Will there be Book burnings on the Whitehouse lawn?

Noooo - think of the carbon footprint!
Maybe book recycling or composting?

Zarathustra · 08-29-2008, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ausinus

Of course not - look at extreme socialism. However, they are far less inclined to tyranny, liberals by their nature standing for the rights of the people.

If you meant liberals like Jefferson and Madison, you're right.

If you were talking about "liberals" like FDR and LBJ, you're crazy.

Davocrat · 08-29-2008, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conservative

Bravo! You are still the all-mighty Davo!

And you're the Board Champion of Hyperbolic Literary Revisionism.