Thread: bin Laden: Dead And Loving It

The bin Laden narrative aptly illustrates the extent to which our government institutions have used the big media and polluted the information environment. Rumor begets hearsay. Hearsay begets opinion. Opinion begets unconfirmed facts, unconfirmed facts beget disinformation begets propaganda begets intelligence, and intelligence begets nonexistent weapons of mass destruction.



What makes these convoluted yarns successful is something I call the "grain of truth" factor. If one or more of the assertions in a far-fetched fable seem plausible, a certain type of person will accept some or all of the rest of the tale because "there’s a grain of truth in it." There is, of course, grain in every pile of horse manure, but that doesn’t make horse manure easy to swallow, does it?



Having said all that, there’s a fair chance that bin Laden really is dead. If he’s hiding along the Afghanistan-Pakistan border high up in the Hindu Kush mountains where helicopters can’t fly, he could have died of a nosebleed by now. And in November 2008 then CIA Director Michael Hayden said bin Laden was still alive, which adds credence to the argument that he wasn’t.



It doesn’t matter either way. Dead or alive, Osama bin Laden is the greatest strategist in the history of human conflict. With no navy or air force or anything that resembles a formal army, he’s managed to whip the world’s mightiest nation like a rented camel. Our economy is shot, the best-trained, best-equipped military in history has been proven impotent, and our moral standing in the world has gone through the sub-basement.



Speculation about bin Laden’s status vis-Ã*-vis mortality is little more than a smoke screen to keep the American hoi polloi from focusing on a harsh reality.

at-Largely



Great post recapping the myth of bin Laden and how it's been proliferated in our culture.

I remember when Former President Bush was getting close to the end of his first term and a rumor started circulating that he already had Osama Bin Laden in custody and would announce it right before election to help him win a second term.



Who would start rumors like that?



I miss the days before blogs, when the media actually had reporters researching and reporting real news... before they could plagerize wikipedia. I believe that news was less biased before the masses had the Internet to make their uninformed voices heard.

There are good op eds and bad op eds. This is a superb example of a bad op ed because it relies on empirical assumptions, not rational reasoning.

Having said all that, there’s a fair chance that bin Laden really is dead.

Define, "fair".

If he’s hiding along the Afghanistan-Pakistan border high up in the Hindu Kush mountains where helicopters can’t fly, he could have died of a nosebleed by now.

Right because when you're living underground in a bunker complex, the air pressure is the same as what's outside not to mention al-Qaeda's assets, infrastructure, and logistics aren't sophisticated enough to support life in harsh environments such as other inhabited mountainous regions around the world (see Peru, Tibet, Switzerland, etc.).

And in November 2008 then CIA Director Michael Hayden said bin Laden was still alive, which adds credence to the argument that he wasn’t.

Right because when you advocate a conspiracy it's legit because of political correctness, but when others advocate conspiracies, they're labeled as nutjobs for being on the wrong side of boo-hurrah.

Dead or alive, Osama bin Laden is the greatest strategist in the history of human conflict. With no navy or air force or anything that resembles a formal army, he’s managed to whip the world’s mightiest nation like a rented camel.

No. See Hernando Cortez, Napoleon Bonaparte, Gustavus Adoplhus, Alexander the Great, Piet Heyn, Attila the Hun, etc. who all accomplished similar feats with considerable more follow through. Furthermore, Osama did not whip the U.S. The U.S.' population succumbed to overreaction and ruined itself after two and a half decades of political, economic, and cultural neglect, neglect which was actually a target of Soviet intelligence subversion protocols for 45 years before the 90s and isn't exactly a novel concept to open the 2000s with.

Our economy is shot

No. It's neglected. There's a difference between a car that won't run and a car that can't run.

the best-trained, best-equipped military in history has been proven impotent,

No. Our military has outperformed every other military in the world when it comes to applying CO-IN doctrine on such a vast scale. Not only have casualties been extraordinarily proportionately low, mission completions incredibly rapid, and command structures incredibly flexible, but the military has operated and maintained a huge expeditionary force efficiently in areas not easily reachable and requiring over the top due diligence to secure.

and our moral standing in the world has gone through the sub-basement.

If by moral standing you mean the opinions of Frenchies, Danes, and other socially liberal welfare statists who don't have any geopolitical capital at all other than thumbing their noses at us, then sure. On the other hand, if you mean honest, hard working, freedom loving admirers from all over the world whether from developed or developing countries, then you're completely off your rocker. The United States is a country where independence and criticism are not only ensured but welcome, and the heterogeneity of our country proves that we are not a country to be despised. Where the chinks in the armor lay are in irresponsibility from giving attention to Bohemian Bourgeois celebrity entertainers such as yourself and believing that their proposed paradigms are actually comprehensive outlooks for success.

Speculation about bin Laden’s status vis-Ã*-vis mortality is little more than a smoke screen to keep the American hoi polloi from focusing on a harsh reality.

It's called due diligence. If you don't cover all your bases, then you're going to get blamed when something goes awry.

Bin Dead has been dead since 2001, december of. All the tapes video and audio are fakes to scare the bejezzus out of you, the sad part is, it worked!

[quote name='Shakes' date='21 February 2010 - 10:24 PM' timestamp='1266819879' post='119339']

You're right, it doesn't matter whether Bin Laden is dead or alive, except for purposes of propaganda. If he's alive then Hitler is still in the bunker. If he's dead Al Qaeda remains. The whole issue of state sponsored terrorism is a smokescreen anyway. Iran is the real problem. They won't have the capacity to enrich uranium to bomb quality for decades but if they can convince the West, and especially their Arab neighbors, otherwise, then they have the "street-cred" they believe they need to lead the Moslem world. Its an enormous, ridiculous pissing-contest that Iran has been holding water for years to win. Israel is just a side-show. Why, do you suppose, we have major military forces in Iraq and Afghanistan? To combat international terrorism? To found benevolent democracies in the Near-East? Or is it to contain Iran?

[/quote]

Iran is not a threat. Do you know what I find odd, the majority of Americans believe they have the bomb. Now that is ridicules.



This country needs to attack Iran and Russia, they need a world war so that default is not out of the question. This is their stand by, and these ego maniacs will get it, and it will destroy this planet.





[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4p1kD8CZX8&feature=player_embedded#[/media]

[quote name='splansing' date='22 February 2010 - 11:20 AM' timestamp='1266866402' post='119589']An Iran with a moderate, rational voice on the international stage would ...

[/quote]

An Iran with a moderate, rational voice on the international stage would be a complete departure from reality as it is and as it has been since Jimmy Carter's day.

[quote name='Disappointed not surprised' date='22 February 2010 - 11:31 AM' timestamp='1266867089' post='119598']

An Iran with a moderate, rational voice on the international stage would be a complete departure from reality as it is and as it has been since Jimmy Carter's day.

[/quote]

Really, huh, how many countries did they invade?