Divide and Conquer

**USA-1** · 13th November 2010 05:57 AM

Napolean an absolute Master at the tactic.

Obama Faces Rebellion From Democratic Left

"Obama must move to the center," Democratic pollster and Fox News commentator Douglas Schoen tells Newsmax. "He must embrace the deficit commission report and findings, and find a way to separate himself from an increasingly unpopular minority leader [House Speaker Nancy Pelosi] who is a drag on his re-election prospects."

I've heard this strat played out via media, "Obama must move to the Center as Clinton did in 1995" and it's a valid strategy if your goal is re-election. Pelosi certainly no popular figure in the nation(and the Dems are going to make her Minority Leader)moving away from her politically would make sense.

Pelosi lambasted the deficit commission proposals that President Obama appears open to considering. And Friday morning, Pelosi stepped her rhetoric against extending the Bush tax cuts, saying they would "heap $700 billion in debt" on voters' backs without creating jobs.

In an indication of the emerging split in the Democratic Party, moderate Democrats, who embrace extension of the Bush tax cuts and cuts in federal spending, have objected to Pelosi's drive to remain her party's leader in the House. Some of them suggest privately that she is too closely identified with big-government policies that contributed to the midterm debacle.

First of all....Pelosi is lambasting a proposal that "heaps $700b in debt" without creating jobs? Oh Nancy...

you have balls of steel Lady, you must be f'n kidding the Oldschool, right? Yer all f'b about heaping billions in debt on voters without creating jobs, you're the f'n Queen of such activity that by the way just got shellacked last week. I cannot believe you Lefties are putting this

back in after such a debacle.

Now, there are some Dems who oppose her and Dems in the Senate who want tax cuts extended for all....and I believe I begin to see a wedge or is it a crack in the Dem Front? Slapping away at the flanks at first, then a wholesale and viscious artillery barrage....is that chaos in the Dem Camp?

Yet in an indication of the delicate tap dance President Obama must conduct, walk, Obama on Friday endorsed Pelosi's bid to continue as Democrats' leader in the House despite the historic "shellacking" her party received on Nov. 2.

“Speaker Pelosi has been an outstanding partner for me,” the president said in response to a question from ABC's Jake Tapper. “[Senate Majority Leader] Harry Reid has been a terrific partner in moving some very difficult legislation forward. And I’m looking forward to working with the entire leadership team to continue to make progress on the issues that are important to the American people."

Many analysts believe Obama's decline among independent voters puts the onus on the president to work out a deal with Republicans, in order to back up his post-election remarks that he only expanded government spending in response to emergency circumstances. But it remains unclear how he can make a Clinton-esque move to the center when only a few conservatives and moderates survived the midterms.

This is a Presidential Pickle for the President. The divide clearly seen here. Does the Dem Party make adjustments is the crucial question here, does the President? This thread would invite comments on this question and what are the ramifications of any adjustment? Is one even needed?

**frodly** · 13th November 2010 06:34 AM

It would be impossible for Obama to govern more to the center. He has been a radical centrist. The only reason anyone has even the slightest inkling otherwise is because of the barrage of lies and deception coming from Fox News and the media as a whole. It is the concept of the big lie. If you say the same blatantly untrue thing enough times, and people begin to believe it is true!! Well I don't. Obama is already in the center. He could move further right and continue more Bush era policies(of which there are many), but he could not possibly move closer to the center. I refuse to give into this lie, even if many people believe it.

**mtm1963** · 13th November 2010 06:46 AM

i would put obama's foreign policy right of center and his domestic policy is certainly left of center. it's his domestic policy that needs to move closer to the center.

mtm1963

**frodly** · 13th November 2010 07:01 AM

Originally Posted by mtm1963

i would put obama's foreign policy right of center and his domestic policy is certainly left of center. it's his domestic policy that needs to move closer to the center.

mtm1963

Like what? Deficit spending? Nope that is well tread territory by Reagan and Bush. Health care? Maybe if he had passed a public option, but that giant gift to the insurance companies? Certainly not!! Financial reform? Same as health care reform!! He could have passed left wing reform, instead he passed centrist reform. He has done nothing that was radically left wing. He did things that were very unpopular, like THIS health care reform, but it was unpopular because it was a handout to the insurance companies. Many people don't realize that, they only notice their premiums went up. Then the media lies to people about why it is unpopular, it is because it is too far left wing!!

People don't care about such things. They are much simpler than that. If the reform had shown immediate dividends to their pocket books, and hadn't forced people to get insurance who didn't want it, people would have liked it no matter how far left the reform had been.

PS. The reform was bad, but not left wing. What stupid democrats didn't understand is the way you cover everyone is by reducing costs enough that you shift the price on the demand curve, and the quantity demanded will shift up, therefore leading more people to demand health insurance. Simple and basic economics. Then you could worry about covering the few people who still wouldn't demand insurance after that point. Instead we got that turd of a bill. A bill that was decidedly not left wing, as handouts to big corporations rarely are.

**mtm1963** · 13th November 2010 07:49 AM

people view things differently as in not wanting to refer to a policy as being right or left when it really is and in this case obama domestic policy as being to the left. Centrist? No way!!

the biggest thing for me is controling spending increases. you can't increase those non-mandatory expenditures at the pace they did in the 2010 budget, somewhere around 10% and at the same time do nothing about mandatory spending. health care reform was no reform in the sense that is just created another government run health care program like medicare and medicaid, both of which have run away costs.

**USA-1** · 13th November 2010 08:54 AM

Originally Posted by frodly

Like what?

Tax cuts.

PS. The reform was bad, but not left wing. What stupid democrats didn't understand is the way you cover everyone is by reducing costs enough that you shift the price on the demand curve, and the quantity demanded will shift up, therefore leading more people to demand health insurance. Simple and basic economics. Then you could worry about covering the few people who still wouldn't demand insurance after that point. Instead we got that turd of a bill. A bill that was decidedly not left wing, as handouts to big corporations rarely are.

What?

**frodly** · 13th November 2010 08:57 AM

Originally Posted by Oldschool

Tax cuts.

What?

First point. Obama is going to extend the Bush tax cuts. So your point is nonsense.

Second point, my analysis was quite simple. Either read what was written or don't, but don't pretend like what was written didn't make sense. It certainly did.

**USA-1** · 13th November 2010 09:33 AM

How would you reduce the costs of health care given your model for success?

**frodly** · 13th November 2010 09:56 AM

Originally Posted by Oldschool

How would you reduce the costs of health care given your model for success?

Remove limitations on competition, which don't allow insurance companies to compete across state lines. A public option. Reduce the barriers to entry, in other words offer government programs that pay for perspective doctors to go to school. Reduce malpractice costs. Reduce the abilities of pharmaceutical companies to create government granted monopolies through the patent system, and replace it with a system that rewards company for research and development, but not to the enormous detriment of the consumer. There are many possibilities. Take your pick. Is it your position that we cannot reduce health care costs? Is it your position that a reduction in health care costs would not lead to more people being insured?

**HenryPorter** · 13th November 2010 11:21 AM

Originally Posted by frodly

Remove limitations on competition, which don't allow insurance companies to compete across state lines. A public option. Reduce the barriers to entry, in other words offer government programs that pay for perspective doctors to go to school. Reduce malpractice costs. Reduce the abilities of pharmaceutical companies to create government granted monopolies through the patent system, and replace it with a system that rewards company for research and development, but not to the enormous detriment of the consumer. There are many possibilities. Take your pick. Is it your position that we cannot reduce health care costs? Is it your position that a reduction in health care costs would not lead to more people being insured?

As an RN who has worked in the healthcare system for a lot of years I have since the election 2 weeks ago started telling uninsured people to not worry about health insurance. Repbulicans will repeal healthcare reform. I am now telling uninsured people just to go to the ER. Healthcare is free there and there are no additional costs to anyone involved. Hospitals just overcharge everyone else with insurance and thus absorb the costs of ER care that doesn't get reimbursed. Its free healtcare with no consequences to anyone. Its win-win. We were wrong, Republicans are right on this one.